GenderLife Forum: The Information Exchange

2015 had sponsors enough to count for all but 18 votes needed to pass as it was originally introduced.

The reason given for splitting it (whereabout it gained 9 sponsors) was fear of a parliamentary procedure that hadn't been used in decades.

It was Politically judicious to push through *something* right then, as the campaign season was heating up and "everyone" knows this is a major turning point for the dems. They needed to do something right then.

So they tossed us under the Bus. And Frank took the lead, even over the counsel of Baldwin, who knew perfectly well what would happen.

In the end, even she struck a deal.

Frank did not do us a favor. We are the one's doing ourselves a favor. He did not damage his own constituency nor did he reduce his clout in the House.

His district is predominantly white, middle to upper middle class white gay men by a strong majority.

He's a toad,part of the assimilationist sorts that immediately preceded the mid 80's turn to militancy and out.

And he's a crafty politician.

It wasn't until well after the ENDA crap roared up that he came out with the eduction line, and he has an abiding and intense personal dislike of the current crop of trans lobbyists.

The assimilationist argument, however, is pretty weak, which he knows, since most transfolks enter stealth and vanish -- the ultimate assimilation.

THe political maneuvering he's untouchable on since he hasn't pissed off the core votes that directly put him in office. He's unreachable, and he knows it.

and this is the second bill he's killed in this manner.

He's not doing us any favors. By angering us, he's actually harming our ability to move forward. As muh as I persinally *loathe* to say it, the HRC is doing us favors. But then, they are currying our favor right now, as they've tapped their principal fundraising base and we're all that's left.

Twixt now and the first week in October, there will be an incredible amount of spin and effort and public "aid" granted by the HRC.

And then there will be something big the first week of October.

ENDA is *life* and *self* to Transfolk. Employment is where everything begins -- even with the AMA's support of insurance.

Without it -- and I've been seeing it now constantly for 6 months up close and personal outside of myself -- too many of us are trapped.

If you are working, you are *blessed* and damn lucky. And if you make more than 8 bucks an hour in the US, you are even more so.

One could argue that he spurred me (and others such as myself) into action to change this *on our own*. To create businesses and essentially practice against all others what is practiced against us and discriminate against the cisgendered.

But it wasn't *him* that did that.

It was why he is that way that did it.

The alarm bells ring whenever I hear or come across this stroy, I say come across as I have no intention of seeking out the story.

IMHO it just screams wrong on so many levels.

I do too, although I feel he did us a favor along the lines of the favor amyotrophic lateral sclerosis did for Stephen Hawking's scientific career, or that cancer did for Lance Armstrong. What he did was terrible but the unintended consequences may work out in our favor.

Well anyhoo, there still are no pregnant dudes.

Esp not Barney though God knows he's tried.

And thus it must follow that it is impossible for a preop to impregnate a woman, right? There was a pregnant dude and his name was Thomas Beatie. He's now father of the child he carried to term. Why would anyone have a problem with that? After all, don't we vociferously defend the notion that we are women born into male bodies? Some would say that is an equally absurd proposition.

Wow.

Ya know, if we are "women", then he is a "man".

I've just spent several days bashing back and forth with trolls and *making them change their minds* successfully, simly by explaining it to them.

Sometimes with very large bricks.

In my book, any girl here who says Thomas Beattie isn't a man, is also saying that they are not a woman, and is, therefore, violating the agreement.

I know that'll piss off a few people.

Its not wrong. IT was love.

FOr cryng out loud, he did the equivalent of *going back* to male and fathering a child and sacrificing herself and her body for 2 years!

Out of Love for his wife. That's self sacrifice.

Now, do I like what he did when it came to the whole promoting it thing? No. Its far too unseemly in that it looks like he did it to pay for the obscenely expensive IVF stuff he had to go through.

I know it takes all kinds, but sheesh. Even here he's being eaten alive, by people who should have known better.

I feel ashamed by association...

Well, I have to say that I don't understand the whole "going public" thing. I am not sure why they did interviews, etc... It is not for me to judge though. I don't know their motivation, nor is it my business.

What I will say is this- I am not the gender police. If he says he is a man, he is a man. It is not for me to decide otherwise. Did he really do something that genetic men would not do given the opportunity or the necessity?

I would guess that if we were to poll childless couples to find out if the father would carry the child were that the only remaining option for a biological child, a HUGE percentage would say yes in a heartbeat. I have seen the desperation that some couples reach when they have tried unsuccessfully to have children. There is almost no length, medically or financially, that they will not go to in order to have a baby that is their "flesh and blood".

Is what this man did really that difficult to understand when you think of it in this perspective? I think he did what thousands of other men would do given the opportunity.

I think the general premise that some people follow is that 'those who bear children are women,' 'those that provide the seed are men'.

It goes to follow that those who can do neither are not men or women, by that logic.

Not exactly appealing.

If I was truly wise enough to know the full consequences of all events in life maybe I would feel comfortable pronouncing a verdict. All I understand at this point is that over 300 glbt organizations rose up and protested. I believe Barney got his fingers burnt at least a little and he is not particularly stupid so maybe he won't use us as a sacrifice in the future.

Here's my $.02:

Christine and Toni, I totally agree with you.

Deena, I agree with you too. I think we're saying the same thing in a different way.